Bonus Episode: Tarot for Networking and Business Development with Ange De Lumiere

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There are 78 cards in a tarot deck.

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22 major Arcana cards.

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And 56 minor Arcana cards.

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Each card carries its own meaning

symbolism, imagery, and narrative.

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Since the mid 15th century, people have

been using taro cards for a variety

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of reasons, primarily rooted in their

fascination with the mystical and the

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desire for insight into their lives.

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Welcome to this special bonus edition of

this shit works hosted by me, Julie Brown.

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And for this special episode,

I have asked my friend and

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previous guest on the podcast.

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Angela Mayer.

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Back to explain taro cards to us.

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And how we can use their meaning to aid

us in networking and business decisions.

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I've had my tarot cards

read numerous times.

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I've asked the deck for answers and

guidance for life, love and business

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during all different stages of my life.

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So when Ann reached out to me

with the idea of bringing taro

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to the podcast, I was intrigued.

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We met and she encouraged me to buy

my own deck of cards, which I did.

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And then immediately became overwhelmed.

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78 cards all with their

own meaning and symbolism.

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Some of the cards like the

death card, the hanged man.

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The devil.

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They look like they have dire warnings.

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And some have no words at all.

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Just symbols, like the 10 of

cups and the two of Pentacles.

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How was I going to be able to decipher

what the cards were trying to tell me?

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Well, I did what everyone

does when they need answers.

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I went straight to the Google machine

and found a guide online that broke

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down each and every card in the deck.

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And what it meant if it

was straight or reversed.

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And I simply started working with them.

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Asking the Decker question, shuffling

the deck, cutting it into three stacks.

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And then picking a card from each stack.

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Choosing three cards to help

me decipher the answer to the

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question I was asking the deck.

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You know, there are a lot of ways you

can ask the deck for answers and they

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get really intricate with their, layouts.

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And I'm not an advanced enough to do that.

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I'm not advanced enough to do

anything beyond three cards.

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So that will come with time.

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Maybe, hopefully.

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What surprised me about this activity?

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Even just this three card activity was

when I focused on one specific question.

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Pick three cards and examine them

to show me what was happening

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or make sense or give direction

to the question I was asking.

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It actually did end up

making a lot of sense.

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You know, if it hadn't made sense.

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And if I hadn't found value in it, I never

would have brought this episode to you.

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But since it was helpful for me, I thought

it might be helpful for you as well.

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And who better than ONJ to teach

us how we can all get started.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: So Ange,

I don't actually know how long it's

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been, but welcome back to the podcast.

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Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

thank you having me back.

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I'm so um, I feel so honored actually

and very excited because , tarot for me

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is a passion it wasn't something, you

know, I didn't think when I was a little

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i'm gonna be a tarot reader one day

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: hmm.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: The way I

became a tarot reader was pretty I would

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say like in like the side, the side,

um, alleys or roads that you take in

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life, I don't think the exact word in

English, but, hit me a bit by surprise.

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And it's funny because I'm writing

my second memoir at the moment,

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which explains how I went from being

a lawyer to being a tarot reader.

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So it's all very relevant.

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But I did the same thing

as you did, um, when I.

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Two years, two days, sorry, um, it's an

intensive training with a tarot local

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established tarot reader where I live.

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And that's where I learned interesting

techniques on how to let go of all the

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actual meaning of the cards because you

can get attached to it, especially if

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you're left brain and if you're logical.

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But I also did, a wonderful

training they go into so much depth.

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The breadth and depth simply mind blowing,

but not everybody wants to have to do

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that in order to use cards for themselves.

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So I've sort of developed a very

simple method that everybody can use.

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And I think we, when we agreed, when

we talked a couple of months back

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about this bonus episode, that my.

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Intention or my, the passion behind

what I want to share today, with you

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and your audience is that I want to

keep people safe with the tarot because

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I consider that the tarot is like a

double edge, sword or like a knife.

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And if, you know, as if any tool, if

you, you can use it, you can cut yourself

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or you can just make a wonderful meal.

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And I want to make sure that people know,

you know, the pitfalls and how to keep,

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on the straight and narrow with the tarot.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah,

so that leads me to a question.

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So say there's somebody who's

like, okay, I'm interested.

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I want to buy a deck.

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Do they do what I do, go

to Google and find a guide?

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\ how would you suggest people

start with getting into tarot?

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Well, the

first thing is to get a tarot deck and

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I can't remember if I recommended one to

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audioJulieBrown21873199593:

You did recommend ones

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

it was a while back,

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: yeah,

I ended up buying a different one.

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Um, but you did recommend

a couple of them to me.

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Yeah.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Are

you happy with the one that you have?

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Good.

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So you need to use your intuition

to choose your own tarot deck.

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That's exactly how you

should choose a tarot deck.

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Intuition is a big part of it.

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Because tarot decks have

energies of their own.

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Now, I know I'm going to stretch

the minds of your listeners

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a little bit around this.

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Uh, however, I am a Reiki master.

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I know a lot about energy.

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And this is how I was able to explain

to myself why the tarot cards worked.

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So I was a healer first before I was

a tarot reader, and that gave me a

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real, understanding that's quite

different from other tarot readers

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on how exactly this stuff works.

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And it kind of links sort of to

the law of attraction, because

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in a way the tarot works as a

mirror from what's inside of you.

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When you shuffle the cards, everybody

will ask you to shuffle the cards,

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you put your energy into the deck,

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: and

the deck then responds to your energy.

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That's how I can put it the

simplest and the least spooky

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way possible for your audience.

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But the proof is in the pudding,

because for me, that's exactly how I

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prove Grass with all these esoteric,

um, techniques that I embraced, you

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know, I was a lawyer to start with.

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And for me, um, I still, I had a pretty

open mind for a lawyer, but for me,

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if it works, I'll continue to use it.

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If it doesn't, I stop.

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And it looks like you had a good

journey with the tarot since we.

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Last spoke, it was helpful.

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I'm super happy that you had this

first hand experience before we talked

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because then you can feed back to me and

tell me, yeah, I think that's useful.

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That's what happened or whatever.

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Have, have you had any difficult

experiences with the tarot?

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: I don't

think I've worked with it enough

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to have a difficult experience yet

because I've just, I've just been

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learning it and reading the cards and

saying, Oh, this is what this means.

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And this is what this means.

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I've only asked it that one question

that one time I've been more trying

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to learn the deck, um, which I think

actually is a really good way for

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me to ask, you know, it's easier to.

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What am I trying to say here?

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So like, to not get bad habits, so can

you, I know that you said, and you didn't

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tell me what they were, but you said

there was three most common mistakes

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people make when using the tarot cards.

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So maybe let's start there because

we don't want to get off on the

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wrong foot when we're starting.

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And I don't want to get off on

the wrong foot either, so I don't

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want, I want to make sure that I

haven't made those three mistakes.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Okay.

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So I can remember two.

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I'll try to remember the third one.

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Probably will come as we discuss.

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No, because I remember writing a

blog post and something back then,

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but, a lot of time has passed.

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So I know that the very

first mistake people make.

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Is to ask the wrong question.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

an art to asking questions.

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Uh, and actually, it's more

than just with the tarot.

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Generally coaches or mentors or people

who try to, help you on your path will

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always try to craft the right question

so that you get the right answer.

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You know, there is, and it's from having

had that experience of 17 years of tarot

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readings, where people come to me and I

know they're asking the wrong question.

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Now, I can't always tell them that,

so I kind of suss out the situation.

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Are they ready to actually

ask the right question?

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And I'll give you a very simple example.

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I'd love to have your feedback on the

tarot readings you've had, because I'm

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kind of interested in people's first hand

experiences of tarot readers as well.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: hmm.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

So, someone came to me and said,

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am I going to marry my boyfriend?

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Well, that, that is

not the right question.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah,

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

That is definitely not the right

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question, but looking back,

insight is such a wonderful thing.

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What you want to ask

is, are we a good fit?

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Are we going to happy together?

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Um, is this going to work out?

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And, and I'm going to give you an example

from what happened to actually me.

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It wasn't a tarot reader.

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It was a psychic medium.

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I went to have my first reading

with American friend, actually,

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who dragged me to see a psychic

in Boston when I visited her.

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And, um, I, I even remember

the name of the guy.

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He was called George.

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And I asked exactly that question.

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That's why I can make fun of myself.

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I'm not making fun of one of my clients.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: I think

everybody who's gone to a tarot

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reader has asked that question.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: exactly.

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And the psychic medium said, I hope

you want to marry him because you will.

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Right?

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Well, that was, that was definitely

a message, very subtle message.

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Let me know.

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I might not be as happy as I thought

I would be marrying that man.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Right.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: He was

very subtle and very good because if I was

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ready to hear that, I would have heard it.

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But because I wasn't, I went straight

into the marriage and divorced

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a few years later with quite a

few scars and missing feathers.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

You know what I mean?

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So, so asking the right

question is so important.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593:

So I do like saying it.

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Instead of are we gonna stay

together, are we gonna be

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together, it is, are we a good fit?

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Which you can sort of do in

all of your relationships.

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Like, any relationship you're

in, you're like, why am I

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struggling with this relationship?

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Am I a good fit?

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Am I pushing it?

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Am I like, whatever?

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: yeah.

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Or what can I do to make

the relationship work?

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Do you know what I mean?

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It's not that subtle, but it's a shift.

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Okay.

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So that's the top, the first,

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: hmm.

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Asking questions

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

um, mistake people make.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Well,

I wouldn't say incorrectly, but what I

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suggest is that people first write down

their question before they ask the deck.

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Because very often by the

time you get the answer, you

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forgot what question you asked.

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You forgot exactly what wording you used.

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And all that is super important because

from the words that you use, you can

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get a completely different answer.

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So I would say take as long as you can.

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I got the third, um, third tip.

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So that's it.

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I'm complete now.

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

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Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

First one, ask the right question.

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But don't panic about asking the

wrong one first, just make it a game,

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get the feedback and do it again

until you understand what's going on.

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And it's very often a good idea to ask,

is it the right time to ask this question?

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Am I ready to ask the question?

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Because we're not always ready to hear the

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: So

I would say this is my first tip.

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Um, the second one, second biggest

mistake is to ask the same question

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until you get the answer that you want.

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I've done that as well.

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you done any of these Julie?

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Because, you know, you've been

having fun and you wanted to

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know if you made those mistakes.

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So,

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: hmm.

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No!

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

tell our audience, your audience,

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: know, in

my tarot card reading, I did go when

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a boyfriend and I broke up, and I did

ask that tarot card reader if we were

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gonna get back together, and she was

quite adamant about the fact that,

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that we were not getting back together.

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And then she was also a psychic,

and she went on to say...

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To perfectly describe the man that I ended

up marrying, which was completely crazy.

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Like, she was like, I will tell

you who you're going to marry.

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He looks like this.

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He does this, like

whatever, blah, blah, blah.

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And I was like, okay, this woman's

cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, you know?

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And then, um, fast forward, however

many years later, I mean, it

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was probably, four years later.

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I never thought of those words

that she mentioned until my

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husband asked me to marry him.

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And when he was asking me to

marry him, I was like, Oh, like

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I remembered everything she said.

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I was like, she knew she could see him on.

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But then, you know, when I was

starting my own business, I did.

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I went to, I talked about success and.

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Was this the right, was this the right

time, was this the right business, was I

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ready, um, I've asked about my husband's

business, not so, I don't know, I

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mean, not that the answers would have

changed my mind, but I almost was like,

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looking for positive reinforcement,

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: And you

know what, this is a very important and

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there's nothing wrong when we take a risk.

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That is trustworthy and that

you trust, then they can just

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give you that little nudge.

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And for me, for years, whatever

psychics readings they were done

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for me, it was always a confirmation

of something I already knew.

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But when it's your intuition speaking and

you don't trust it just yet, it's nice

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to have that reinforcement, isn't it?

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: yeah, yeah,

yeah, yeah, like I said, it wasn't going

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to change me from, I was still going

to go through with it, I just, I don't

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know, I trusted my own gut, that's what

I was doing, but you always want somebody

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else to say, yeah, this is, or not even

somebody else, like you want the universe

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to say that this is the right decision,

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audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

yeah, yeah, yeah.

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As I said, I think it's,

um, it's human to want that

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reinforcement, that encouragement.

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Um, and I don't think there's

anything wrong with that.

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So, but, um, my question was also directed

as when you did readings for yourself.

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Did you ask the right question?

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Did you ask the same again until you

got the answer you wanted to hear?

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audioJulieBrown21873199593: I only did

it once, and I, I, I gotta be honest,

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I didn't write down the question

so I don't exactly remember what it

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was, but, um, you know, I've, I've

changed some things in my business.

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Over the past year, I've sort of

dissolved the consultancy part of my

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business and now pretty much speak and

coach full time, and with that came

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: 00:14:43

some growing pains and some changes

to reoccurring revenue and, just.

303

: 00:14:49

financial, it was a financial thing,

shift that happened in the business.

304

: 00:14:54

And so when you let go a very

lucrative part of the business to grow

305

: 00:14:58

another part that gives you more joy.

306

: 00:15:00

There's some financial

ramifications, um, with that.

307

: 00:15:03

And so, I think I asked something to the

effect of, did I make the right decision?

308

: 00:15:08

Like, even though this is hard,

is this the right decision?

309

: 00:15:12

And I pulled the three cards, and

so, somewhere I had read that, you

310

: 00:15:16

could interpret the three cards

as past, present, and future.

311

: 00:15:20

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Yes, that's right.

312

: 00:15:21

Yeah, that's a good one.

313

: 00:15:22

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

it rang complete.

314

: 00:15:24

I wish I had taken notes when I did it.

315

: 00:15:26

but it rang completely true about where

I was, you know, where I have the company

316

: 00:15:32

had been and where it was now financially.

317

: 00:15:34

And then it had a really,

really bright sort of card

318

: 00:15:38

interpretation for the future.

319

: 00:15:40

And it just made me feel really good.

320

: 00:15:42

So

321

: 00:15:45

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

That's perfect.

322

: 00:15:46

It's absolutely perfect.

323

: 00:15:47

Yeah.

324

: 00:15:48

So congratulations.

325

: 00:15:50

You avoided at least two, I think

three actually of the top mistakes.

326

: 00:15:54

Do you want me to get

on with the third one?

327

: 00:15:56

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

I would love that.

328

: 00:15:57

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Oh yes, we did.

329

: 00:15:58

Yeah.

330

: 00:15:59

So the third one is don't use tarot

cards when you're feeling depressed.

331

: 00:16:04

Okay, and I'm not using that word

lightly, um, but it could also be

332

: 00:16:09

when you're feeling really down or

discouraged or very dark when you, when

333

: 00:16:13

you're feeling dark, dark emotions.

334

: 00:16:15

And the reason is, is the tarot, because

it's a mirror, it reflects back to

335

: 00:16:21

you, um, you would probably interpret

all the cards that you're seeing as

336

: 00:16:26

the worst possible interpretation.

337

: 00:16:28

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah,

338

: 00:16:29

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: So,

for that reason, I don't encourage

339

: 00:16:32

people to use the tarot cards when

they're feeling down, or when they're

340

: 00:16:35

feeling in a very difficult...

341

: 00:16:37

It's better to ask someone else to

read them for you, because they'll have

342

: 00:16:40

a bit of distance from the problem.

343

: 00:16:43

And also, um, I mean,

there's oracle cards.

344

: 00:16:47

I think they're better for that,

because they don't have the

345

: 00:16:49

death card like you mentioned at

the very start of this episode.

346

: 00:16:52

They don't have the hanged man and all

these things that can really trigger us.

347

: 00:16:56

When we see these cards

348

: 00:16:57

for someone who might do that on their

own, especially if they haven't done

349

: 00:17:00

any therapy, or if they haven't done

any self reflection, or if they don't

350

: 00:17:04

journal, that can be a bit tricky.

351

: 00:17:07

audioJulieBrown21873199593: You know,

I think a lot of the times that I've

352

: 00:17:10

had my cards read, the people that

read them were also intuitives, or

353

: 00:17:15

sensitives, or psychics, or mediums,

and So I think that there was a lot more

354

: 00:17:22

going on in that reading, um, because

I've had some, so tarot card readers

355

: 00:17:27

who, reading my cards, they just said

things to me that they could never know,

356

: 00:17:31

the cards would never tell them this.

357

: 00:17:34

And so if somebody's listening, saying,

hey, I would like to use this tool for

358

: 00:17:38

myself for answers, but I'm not intuitive,

I'm not psychic, I don't have a third eye,

359

: 00:17:43

I'm not an, uh, you know, a sensitive,

what is your advice to people who are,

360

: 00:17:48

like, don't have those other abilities.

361

: 00:17:51

Like I don't have the, I don't

have those other abilities.

362

: 00:17:54

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

is a very, very good question.

363

: 00:17:56

First of all, I'm going

to debunk one myth.

364

: 00:17:58

Everybody's intuitive.

365

: 00:18:00

Not everybody's psychic,

but everybody's intuitive.

366

: 00:18:02

It's built into us as a sort

of protection mechanism.

367

: 00:18:06

It's that gut feeling that you

get, uh, that we all get as kids.

368

: 00:18:10

And the only reason why we don't think

we're intuitive is because it's been

369

: 00:18:13

knocked out of us through schooling.

370

: 00:18:16

So, we're all intuitive.

371

: 00:18:18

You don't need to be psychic to

benefit from the tarot, because

372

: 00:18:22

the tarot is actually going to help

you tune into your own intuition.

373

: 00:18:25

What's really important is to set

an intention for your tarot deck.

374

: 00:18:30

So for me, I asked that my readings with

my tarot deck and I, I sort of, it's not

375

: 00:18:37

consecrate, it's too big a word, but I

always set an intent for each of my decks.

376

: 00:18:41

And it's always that I want the

readings to be helpful, to be, um,

377

: 00:18:46

uplifting and to be inspirational.

378

: 00:18:50

Now you could set your intent to

whatever you might want to set

379

: 00:18:53

your intent that it's accurate.

380

: 00:18:55

Obviously, for me, I want it to

be accurate and it's, it's good

381

: 00:18:58

to play with different words and

maybe I encourage people to actually

382

: 00:19:02

start an intuition journal, right?

383

: 00:19:04

Like this and in it, so you've done

only one reading, but now if you

384

: 00:19:09

want to do more, write down it.

385

: 00:19:12

Your question, what card you're getting,

what do you think it means, and then

386

: 00:19:17

leave a space, I've left space here

for example, so that I can get back

387

: 00:19:21

to it in two, three, four weeks time,

four months, when I actually get the

388

: 00:19:24

confirmation, when the thing actually

happens, and then I can get back and

389

: 00:19:28

say, Oh, what did I read back then?

390

: 00:19:31

Because what you want is to do some

detective work on your own intuition

391

: 00:19:35

so that you trust it more and more.

392

: 00:19:39

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

393

: 00:19:40

I should have done that.

394

: 00:19:42

I should have, um,

395

: 00:19:45

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Does that make sense?

396

: 00:19:45

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

yes, I should have done that.

397

: 00:19:47

I

398

: 00:19:47

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

But you didn't know,

399

: 00:19:48

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I didn't,

yeah, I guess that's why you're here.

400

: 00:19:51

Um,

401

: 00:19:52

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

exactly, that's why I'm here.

402

: 00:19:53

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I should

have had the journal and I should have

403

: 00:19:55

said this was the question I asked and

these were the cards that I pulled.

404

: 00:19:59

So, um,

405

: 00:19:59

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: and

that, that's fine, now you know,

406

: 00:20:01

and, and your audience will know.

407

: 00:20:02

This is exactly why I

wanted to come here today.

408

: 00:20:05

Because I don't think there's only so much

you can learn on Google about this stuff.

409

: 00:20:10

And...

410

: 00:20:11

And then there's people who have

the experience, the first lived

411

: 00:20:14

experience, and then I think these

people have, you know, an input.

412

: 00:20:17

And, and of course everybody's different.

413

: 00:20:19

Some people will like

me, some people won't.

414

: 00:20:21

And I'm not taking this personally.

415

: 00:20:22

There's, um, as many flavors of tarot

readers and tarot teachers as there are

416

: 00:20:27

pupils and, and different, affinities.

417

: 00:20:30

But I like to keep it.

418

: 00:20:33

It's super simple.

419

: 00:20:34

Maybe it's because of

my lawyer's background.

420

: 00:20:35

I like to keep it practical and grounded.

421

: 00:20:38

And I will say to you one thing that's

really helped in, um, both training

422

: 00:20:42

that I did with the tarot, is that,

yeah, it's okay to try to learn all the

423

: 00:20:45

meaning, but you'll never remember it all.

424

: 00:20:47

Not in the moment.

425

: 00:20:48

So it's okay to check the little book

that comes with your tarot whilst

426

: 00:20:52

you build your confidence with it.

427

: 00:20:54

But what you want to do, even if you

read the book, is when you open it and

428

: 00:20:58

you read sentences, Check within your

body the ones that resonate with you,

429

: 00:21:04

and that's how you're going to know

what is correct and what doesn't matter.

430

: 00:21:09

By reading it, you will have

a feeling inside your body.

431

: 00:21:13

audioJulieBrown21873199593: So, when

it comes to networking and business

432

: 00:21:15

development, what are the kinds of

questions we could ask the deck?

433

: 00:21:24

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Like,

suppose we met, you and I met in

434

: 00:21:26

a networking event, and you want

to know if I'm a good prospect.

435

: 00:21:30

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

436

: 00:21:31

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Just ask the cards, you see.

437

: 00:21:33

Should I pursue her?

438

: 00:21:34

Should I, you know, try to organize

a one to one meeting with her?

439

: 00:21:39

What kind of synergies

could happen between us?

440

: 00:21:40

All these questions you can ask the card.

441

: 00:21:42

audioJulieBrown21873199593: hmm.

442

: 00:21:44

Okay.

443

: 00:21:46

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: It

can save you wasting your time on

444

: 00:21:48

someone, for example, that is really

not a good match with who you are.

445

: 00:21:52

If you think about someone, but you're

feeling guilty, you're like, I don't know

446

: 00:21:55

this person from, you know, a bar soap.

447

: 00:21:58

Why am I having this

reaction to that person?

448

: 00:22:00

You're feeling bad about it.

449

: 00:22:01

And you want to see, is

there something in it?

450

: 00:22:04

You know, is it because I was having

a bad day or is it really that I need

451

: 00:22:07

to be careful around that person?

452

: 00:22:09

Pull a card and you'll get the answer.

453

: 00:22:11

And I'll teach you a technique.

454

: 00:22:12

And I don't know if you found

that on your Google journey,

455

: 00:22:15

audioJulieBrown21873199593: No.

456

: 00:22:15

All right.

457

: 00:22:16

So, should I take out my card?

458

: 00:22:17

Should I take out my deck right now?

459

: 00:22:18

Okay.

460

: 00:22:19

Okay.

461

: 00:22:19

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

I will show you a technique

462

: 00:22:20

to ask a yes or no question.

463

: 00:22:22

Have you found a technique online to

ask a yes or no question yet or not?

464

: 00:22:26

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I got my deck.

465

: 00:22:27

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Okay.

466

: 00:22:28

So what you do first, you knock your deck

because that kind of clears the energy

467

: 00:22:32

really quickly from everything else you

would have done before because the deck

468

: 00:22:35

gets builds energy from all the readings.

469

: 00:22:37

So you want to clear

the, yeah, the energy.

470

: 00:22:40

Then you shuffle it.

471

: 00:22:41

No, actually, then what you

do, you split it in two.

472

: 00:22:45

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

473

: 00:22:46

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

And then you turn one upside down,

474

: 00:22:49

and you get it back together.

475

: 00:22:51

So you have half the cards, at least

half the cards, especially if it's

476

: 00:22:54

new, that are going to be upside,

um, upright, or, uh, reversed.

477

: 00:22:58

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yep.

478

: 00:23:00

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Then

you shuffle, and you ask your question.

479

: 00:23:02

Now you want to focus on your

question whilst you shuffle.

480

: 00:23:04

So you have a question you want to ask

now, that would be a yes or no answer.

481

: 00:23:09

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Um,

I, I, Of course I'm blanking!

482

: 00:23:14

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Okay.

483

: 00:23:14

Okay.

484

: 00:23:15

Okay.

485

: 00:23:15

Okay.

486

: 00:23:15

So let's ask, I'm going to ask my

deck and you can ask your deck,

487

: 00:23:18

is this episode is going to be

useful for you to audience, right?

488

: 00:23:22

Let's have a bit of fun.

489

: 00:23:23

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

490

: 00:23:24

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

So is this episode going to

491

: 00:23:26

have a good, be beneficial?

492

: 00:23:29

One or two, three times in your mind so

that you really focus your mind on that.

493

: 00:23:33

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

494

: 00:23:35

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: And then

you pull the card out and it doesn't

495

: 00:23:39

matter how you pull it, where you

pull it and whether you turn it around

496

: 00:23:43

when you do, and then you, thank you.

497

: 00:23:46

Um, and then, right, you have an

upright and I have an upright.

498

: 00:23:50

This is a yes.

499

: 00:23:51

audioJulieBrown21873199593: King of Wands.

500

: 00:23:52

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

card, yeah, the card doesn't matter.

501

: 00:23:55

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

it doesn't matter!

502

: 00:23:56

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: no, what

matters is if it's upright or reversed.

503

: 00:23:59

If it's upright, it's a yes.

504

: 00:24:00

If it's reversed,

505

: 00:24:01

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

Oh, I actually pulled it up.

506

: 00:24:03

I pulled it this way and then

turned it to show it to you.

507

: 00:24:06

So mine was upside down.

508

: 00:24:09

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: so

mine is a yes and yours is a no.

509

: 00:24:11

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

the odds on this one.

510

: 00:24:13

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Well,

what I would take out of this is

511

: 00:24:16

that not all of your audience is

going to enjoy the episode, but it

512

: 00:24:19

will be relevant for some, right?

513

: 00:24:22

That's useful actually as an information.

514

: 00:24:24

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Let's say

I had a question about my business.

515

: 00:24:28

For example, I a lot of times have

to go back and forth with potential

516

: 00:24:34

clients and I have to decide, if

they don't have my full fee, is this

517

: 00:24:39

a client that I should still work

with and discount my fee because.

518

: 00:24:44

I like the group or I

like, you know, whatever.

519

: 00:24:47

Um, but that is a business decision

that I have to make over and over

520

: 00:24:50

again with potential clients.

521

: 00:24:52

Like, is that something I could ask the

522

: 00:24:55

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: absolutely.

523

: 00:24:56

Yeah, you ask it the way I've shown you,

524

: 00:24:58

audioJulieBrown21873199593: So I

have a, I have a potential client

525

: 00:25:00

that I met with this morning.

526

: 00:25:02

There's no way they would have

my fee, but I still, like, I,

527

: 00:25:06

it would be a feel good event.

528

: 00:25:08

But it still does take a day out of

my calendar that I have to travel

529

: 00:25:12

to the event, so I have to decide on

530

: 00:25:15

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

how would you phrase the question?

531

: 00:25:17

How would you phrase that?

532

: 00:25:18

We're going to have a bit

of a little play with that.

533

: 00:25:19

audioJulieBrown21873199593: okay,

I guess the question would be, One

534

: 00:25:26

of the questions would, if I decide

yes, well, you know, would it be,

535

: 00:25:30

will I regret taking on this client

or should I take on this client?

536

: 00:25:39

Um,

537

: 00:25:39

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: So I

think the second one is not precise

538

: 00:25:42

enough because you should say, should

I take this client at the rate that, or

539

: 00:25:46

whatever, you add the price behind it.

540

: 00:25:48

audioJulieBrown21873199593: So

I think that's a good question.

541

: 00:25:50

Should I take this client at

a 75 percent reduced rate?

542

: 00:25:56

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Okay.

543

: 00:25:57

Go focus, do what I've just

544

: 00:26:00

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Do I

have to tap at the deck because,

545

: 00:26:02

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: asked

you to do and ask the question.

546

: 00:26:05

Yes, because we asked the question before,

547

: 00:26:06

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

548

: 00:26:07

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: you

shuffle them without looking at them.

549

: 00:26:09

Yeah.

550

: 00:26:09

So with your deck It's

difficult to see which one is

551

: 00:26:12

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

Oh, I forgot to, um, cut it.

552

: 00:26:14

I forgot to cut it in half.

553

: 00:26:16

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: That's fine

554

: 00:26:17

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay,

555

: 00:26:17

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Just do it now

556

: 00:26:18

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

Okay, so I'll cut

557

: 00:26:19

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

cut it in half turn it around

558

: 00:26:21

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

559

: 00:26:22

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

and just focus on that question.

560

: 00:26:23

Should I take on?

561

: 00:26:25

Just think of the name

at 75 percent of my rate

562

: 00:26:31

You could add, you could phrase

it slightly differently saying,

563

: 00:26:34

would it be for my highest good?

564

: 00:26:36

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Mm

565

: 00:26:37

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

To da da da.

566

: 00:26:39

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay,

so I'm now pulling out a card.

567

: 00:26:45

Uh oh.

568

: 00:26:45

It's upside down.

569

: 00:26:47

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Okay, that means no.

570

: 00:26:49

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

571

: 00:26:50

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

How do you feel about that no

572

: 00:26:52

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I feel

bad about it because I like them.

573

: 00:26:56

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: Okay,

574

: 00:26:57

So what you could do next is to journal

around that no, how you feel and is

575

: 00:27:03

it just guilt and in which case you

can overcome that guilt and just tune

576

: 00:27:09

into actually how you feel about doing

it or not and you can override the

577

: 00:27:12

cards because I don't think there's

going to be any dire consequences

578

: 00:27:15

if you decided to do it anyway.

579

: 00:27:17

But you could ask another question.

580

: 00:27:19

So, If we wrote down the question that

we just asked, should I do it for 25%?

581

: 00:27:24

Maybe you could ask the question, um,

should I work with this client at 50%?

582

: 00:27:29

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Okay.

583

: 00:27:30

Yep.

584

: 00:27:30

Okay.

585

: 00:27:31

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

The bar a little bit.

586

: 00:27:32

Let's see if it's a yes at that.

587

: 00:27:34

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

So I'm gonna cut

588

: 00:27:35

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: That's

why I said don't ask just the one thing.

589

: 00:27:38

Add the price at the back because

that's the defining factor for you.

590

: 00:27:41

There's something in there, right?

591

: 00:27:43

audioJulieBrown21873199593: okay.

592

: 00:27:43

It's the same card, but

it's this, it's straight up.

593

: 00:27:46

How weird is that?

594

: 00:27:47

Is this safe?

595

: 00:27:48

I don't know if anybody, this is,

again, this is not a visual medium,

596

: 00:27:51

but to pull the same exact card

out of 78 cards, that's crazy.

597

: 00:28:01

To pull the same exact card.

598

: 00:28:03

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

you do the maths.

599

: 00:28:04

I don't do the maths anymore,

but it's, I agree with you.

600

: 00:28:07

So by going, see if you hadn't asked that.

601

: 00:28:10

75 or 50, you wouldn't have

actually a precise answer.

602

: 00:28:15

If you had stopped, I, shall I work with

them at 75 percent and it was a no, you

603

: 00:28:19

wouldn't have worked with them at all.

604

: 00:28:21

But you go to the next question and

next, it's an inquisitive process.

605

: 00:28:25

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah, how

weird is it to pull the same exact card

606

: 00:28:28

on the same question and have it be?

607

: 00:28:31

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: I always

say it's, yeah, it's weird and wonderful.

608

: 00:28:35

Don't forget to add the

wonderful at the end.

609

: 00:28:37

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah, um,

610

: 00:28:40

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: I love it.

611

: 00:28:41

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I I'm shocked

by this that it's the same exact cards.

612

: 00:28:44

Um, this is the two of What is it?

613

: 00:28:48

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: I think

it's the two of wands and there's

614

: 00:28:51

a card about, I'm going to say as

a joke, it's the card of the war.

615

: 00:28:56

It's called domination.

616

: 00:28:58

It's the card of the person

who has success, who's happy.

617

: 00:29:00

So you have that.

618

: 00:29:01

It's not just the card.

619

: 00:29:03

It's also just the upright or not.

620

: 00:29:05

Then if you want, you can

explore the meaning of the card.

621

: 00:29:08

You got a yes, but it was this

card, not the 77 other cards.

622

: 00:29:12

So you can go deeper into

the meaning of the card.

623

: 00:29:14

So this is a, an extremely positive card

to get for your answer, especially at 50%.

624

: 00:29:19

So what you need to do is trust

that client a little bit and

625

: 00:29:23

see if they're going to bite.

626

: 00:29:25

It's going to be good for them.

627

: 00:29:27

Because they need to have more belief

in their, whatever they're doing.

628

: 00:29:32

And it's better for you because

you don't give away 75 percent

629

: 00:29:36

audioJulieBrown21873199593: right.

630

: 00:29:37

Yeah No,

631

: 00:29:38

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

how the tarot can help with

632

: 00:29:40

such a simple decision.

633

: 00:29:41

But as we discussed earlier, it's the

art of asking the right question and

634

: 00:29:46

then questioning the answer with more

questions until you get to a point where

635

: 00:29:50

you feel good about whatever is happening.

636

: 00:29:53

audioJulieBrown21873199593: is there

a point of like oversaturation where

637

: 00:29:56

you're just asking too many questions

and you're just doing it too much?

638

: 00:30:00

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Just as you would in any normal

639

: 00:30:02

decision process in your business.

640

: 00:30:04

You can overthink things and you can

exhaust yourself and also You know,

641

: 00:30:08

um, top mistake number two, asking

the same question again and again,

642

: 00:30:12

and then you confuse the cards as

well because the cards are saying,

643

: 00:30:16

I gave you the answer already.

644

: 00:30:17

Why are you asking again?

645

: 00:30:19

I'm fed up with you and they

might mess with you then.

646

: 00:30:22

And I've had that happen to me.

647

: 00:30:24

If I don't trust the answers I'm

getting first and I ask three days

648

: 00:30:26

later the same question, unless I

say to the cards, look, I'm so sorry.

649

: 00:30:29

I'm not confident at the moment.

650

: 00:30:30

I really need that bit of reinforcement.

651

: 00:30:32

Okay.

652

: 00:30:33

But if you mess with the cards, the

cards are going to mess with you.

653

: 00:30:36

It's that mirror thing.

654

: 00:30:41

audioJulieBrown21873199593: So, I

mean, I just, I, I found, I, you

655

: 00:30:44

know what, I know we pulled, you

and I both pulled one upside down

656

: 00:30:47

and one right side up about whether

or not this was going to be useful.

657

: 00:30:50

It's been supremely useful for me right

now just in doing this little exercise

658

: 00:30:54

with the cards right this second.

659

: 00:30:57

I want to go back to how we

decided to do this, episode.

660

: 00:31:01

Were you doing something

specifically tarot for networking?

661

: 00:31:06

Can you refresh my memory?

662

: 00:31:08

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: I

don't remember precisely, but I

663

: 00:31:10

wanted to make sure that people

had enough, it's becoming popular.

664

: 00:31:14

I see blogs everywhere, but not

everybody knows enough about

665

: 00:31:17

that tarot to do it right.

666

: 00:31:19

And I wanted to make sure that your

audience had that bit of information

667

: 00:31:23

that's useful to get started.

668

: 00:31:25

So I think that's how we got, and

you said, Oh, that sounds like a

669

: 00:31:28

great idea for my Halloween special.

670

: 00:31:30

And I thought, yeah,

let's spook everyone out.

671

: 00:31:33

I've spooked you.

672

: 00:31:35

Your tarot spooked you with this card.

673

: 00:31:38

Perfect!

674

: 00:31:39

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

with the same exact.

675

: 00:31:41

Like, I can't, like, statistically,

to shuffle the deck out of 78 cards

676

: 00:31:46

and pull the same exact card is

just statistically unbelievable.

677

: 00:31:52

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593: so, Julie,

write this in your intuition journal.

678

: 00:31:55

You've learned something, you've

learned lots of interesting things.

679

: 00:31:58

You might want to write them

in your, in your journal as

680

: 00:31:59

well, so you remember them.

681

: 00:32:01

Well, obviously you'll be able to listen

to the, to the recording and then.

682

: 00:32:05

That particular reading,

that was super powerful.

683

: 00:32:07

Even the one where we got reversed,

I had one and you had the other.

684

: 00:32:10

I think it's still very valuable.

685

: 00:32:13

audioJulieBrown21873199593:

Yeah, definitely.

686

: 00:32:14

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

The interest is not always

687

: 00:32:15

to get the yes or the no.

688

: 00:32:17

It's in interpreting what

does that really mean?

689

: 00:32:21

audioJulieBrown21873199593: I hope

this, just this little thing that we

690

: 00:32:24

did makes people curious enough, if they

weren't already curious enough to say.

691

: 00:32:30

How can I use this?

692

: 00:32:31

This sounds like something really

interesting, and informative.

693

: 00:32:34

And this is another tool.

694

: 00:32:36

It's not the only tool that you're

going to use in your business,

695

: 00:32:38

but this is another tool.

696

: 00:32:40

And I agree.

697

: 00:32:41

I think more and more people are using it.

698

: 00:32:43

I'm super excited that we did this.

699

: 00:32:45

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

And it's healthy.

700

: 00:32:47

It is healthy to approach that

kind of thing with the skepticism

701

: 00:32:49

because you don't want to be

enrolled into some sort of weird

702

: 00:32:52

cult or, you know, crazy practice.

703

: 00:32:55

But I think it's the experimentation

and keeping an open mind.

704

: 00:32:59

Always use your

discernment as well, right?

705

: 00:33:02

You don't want to decide on a 10

million dollar investment only

706

: 00:33:05

on the basis of the tarot cards.

707

: 00:33:07

You got to use your,

your, you're not here.

708

: 00:33:10

When you do the tarot, you're

not here to put your business

709

: 00:33:13

acumen behind you, right?

710

: 00:33:15

It's supposed to enhance everything else.

711

: 00:33:18

Does that make sense?

712

: 00:33:18

So

713

: 00:33:19

audioJulieBrown21873199593: Yeah.

714

: 00:33:20

Well, thank you so much for being here.

715

: 00:33:22

This was I I enjoyed it.

716

: 00:33:25

I had a lot of fun.

717

: 00:33:27

So I'm so glad that you suggested

this and that we actually ended

718

: 00:33:30

up doing it as a bonus episode.

719

: 00:33:32

audioAngeDeLumiere11873199593:

Thank you for having me.

720

: 00:33:34

It's always such a pleasure.

721

: 00:33:38

Was this episode, a little booboo.

722

: 00:33:41

Yes.

723

: 00:33:42

Am I still totally into it.

724

: 00:33:45

Also, yes.

725

: 00:33:46

I have to tell you that quick

exercise that we did with me asking

726

: 00:33:51

the deck, that question about

taking that gig at a reduced rate.

727

: 00:33:54

And then getting the same

fucking card twice in a row.

728

: 00:33:59

After shuffling, cutting and

shuffling again, like that's uncanny.

729

: 00:34:04

And even though it was the same card.

730

: 00:34:06

It was different answers because in

one question it was straight up and

731

: 00:34:10

in the other one, it was a reversed.

732

: 00:34:12

Like what.

733

: 00:34:13

How's it possible to go through all that

and pick up the same exact fucking card.

734

: 00:34:17

The card was the two of wants.

735

: 00:34:20

So I decided to dig a little

further into the card because

736

: 00:34:23

it can't just be a coincidence

that it came up twice in a row.

737

: 00:34:26

Right.

738

: 00:34:27

You know, the second time I asked

it was, you know, the second

739

: 00:34:31

time I asked it, it was upright.

740

: 00:34:33

It meant that I should say yes to the

opportunity at that 50% reduced rate.

741

: 00:34:39

Upon further research.

742

: 00:34:40

I learned that the upright two of

wands predict success in creative

743

: 00:34:45

ventures, especially those that

involve partnership or cooperation.

744

: 00:34:50

Oh, my gosh, when it comes to

money and progress at work, or as

745

: 00:34:53

an entrepreneur, the two of wands

represents financial stability.

746

: 00:34:57

Moreover, it urges you to survey

the situation carefully and

747

: 00:35:01

then create a plan for success.

748

: 00:35:04

This is literally the exact type of

business advice I was, uh, looking for.

749

: 00:35:09

When it came to this particular client

and this particular question of whether

750

: 00:35:13

or not to work with this client.

751

: 00:35:16

No.

752

: 00:35:18

After this, I think I'm going to be

tuning into this deck a lot in the future.

753

: 00:35:23

What do you think, would you trust the

taro to help you make business decisions?

754

: 00:35:27

Or is this a little too out there for you?

755

: 00:35:30

Anyways, let me know.

756

: 00:35:31

I can't wait to hear if you

have your own tarot stories.

757

: 00:35:35

Okay.

758

: 00:35:35

It's that time onto the drink of the

week, which is the fortune teller

759

: 00:35:39

cocktail from the cosmic cocktails book.

760

: 00:35:43

Here's what you're going to need.

761

: 00:35:45

One and a half ounces of Blanco tequila,

one ounce of Sherry, one ounce of cherry

762

: 00:35:50

liqour and a lemon peel for garnish.

763

: 00:35:52

What you're going to do is you're

going to fill a rocks glass with ice.

764

: 00:35:55

And then add the liquors and stir

and garnish with a lemon peel.

765

: 00:35:59

That's a strong ass drink, dude.

766

: 00:36:02

I mean, You don't need a

fortune teller to tell you no.

767

: 00:36:06

You're going to be tipsy

after you drink that one.

768

: 00:36:09

Okay.

769

: 00:36:10

All right, friends.

770

: 00:36:10

That's all for this week.

771

: 00:36:11

If you like what you heard

today, please leave a review

772

: 00:36:14

and subscribe to the podcast.

773

: 00:36:15

Also, please remember to share the podcast

to help it reach a larger audience.

774

: 00:36:18

If you want more, Julie Brown, you

can find my book works on Amazon.

775

: 00:36:21

Or barnes and noble you can find me on

linkedin at julie brown On Bd just let

776

: 00:36:24

me know where you found me when you

reach out i'm julie brown underscore

777

: 00:36:27

BD on the instagram or you can always

pop on over to my website julie

778

: 00:36:31

brown bd.com until next week Cheers